Comedian Jess Robinson on finding love again after separation

Jess Robinson 0:00 I texted a friend of mine who had been through a divorce and I just said, I just feel like I'll never be happy again. I don't know how I'll ever be happy again. And he said, You will. I promise you, you will. And you, I could not believe it at the time. I honestly couldn't. Things were so dark. I was so down in the weeds. But if this is happening to you, it's possible and you will be happy again. And you've just got to keep putting one foot in front of the other, just small steps, one day at a time, one hour at a time. Kate Daly 0:37 Welcome to the Divorce Podcast, where we explore all aspects of ending relationships, separation, and parenting apart. If your marriage or partnership has ended, or you have friends and family who are separating, this podcast is for you. I'm Kate Daly, a relationship counsellor, divorce specialist, and co-founder of Amicable, the online legal service separating couples. In each episode, we look at relationships and separation from different angles, including the emotional, legal, and social. I'm joined by experts and special guests who share their own unique stories, experience, and tips with the goal of helping people end relationships in a kinder and better way. What happens when you finally stop ignoring your gut? And what does life look like on the other side? Today I'm joined by Jess Robinson, multi-award-winning comedy impressionist, to hear her honest story of separation, dating again, and finding unexpected happiness as a step up. We talk about shame, new beginnings, and why all roads really do lead to here. A quick heads up about this episode. It contains some adult themes, so please take care of yourself whilst listening. If you loved this episode, then please subscribe and rate us on your preferred listening platform. Welcome, Jess. Thank you so much. It's super lovely to have you on the show. Thanks ever so much for joining us. Let's start then with a bit about your story. So, at the beginning, how did you meet your ex-partner? Take us back to when the marriage ended. What was that period like for you? Jess Robinson 2:19 So we met in a sort of a comedy sketch group, and I thought that he was beautiful and very, very funny and silly, and I just loved his sense of humor. And I felt like we had a lot in common. And then over about eight years in all, we were together, but only married for the last sort of 18 months of that. We had a house together, we didn't have any kids. But actually, when I spoke to my therapist about it once the relationship was sort of ending, my therapist said, When was the first time you really, if you look inside yourself and you're really honest, what is the first time you knew that it wasn't quite right? And actually, it was very, very, very early on, very soon after I met him. I knew in my heart of hearts that something was not quite right, but I ignored it because I thought that I was for some reason it was a limitation. It was something to do with me. It was my problem. Why, you know, I thought I was too traditional, too prudish, too this, too that, too vanilla. And I wanted to be more exciting and I wanted to be more wild and cool. But actually, I am quite traditional. And so I really shut a huge piece of myself away and didn't give it any credence, I guess, because I thought, yeah, so I changed myself really and my values because I just loved this guy so much. And I thought he was so brilliant, so exciting, so wonderful. And I think he also felt probably that he had to change himself to be with me and meet me in the middle of it. But that was much easier said than done for him. So what ended up happening was it turned out that there were a lot of secrets and a lot of things that came out after the marriage. And actually, even before I actually walked down the aisle, I remember looking out of my kitchen window at the garden and thinking, I don't know if I can do this forever. But even then, the hope is so strong, and you just sort of I ended up just ignoring the red flags, the warning signals. Yeah. The warning signals, yeah, because I just, this guy in every other way was so brilliant. And all our friends who didn't know anything that was going on because I kept it all very secret myself, they all just said, Oh, you're so funny together, you're so great together. And so it was, I felt like I'd be disappointing absolutely everyone, not just him or me or our parents or whatever. So it just kept going and going until something happened or was said that I I couldn't ignore. And actually, it was such a relief in the end. Kate Daly 5:16 It's so interesting when you say that because it's it's it's a brave thing to say, I think, that on some level you knew quite early on, and even before you got married. But I wonder whether that's not the truth for quite a lot of people, and just some of us aren't very good at admitting that. But it just really resonates that you say, I think on some level I knew. Jess Robinson 5:39 Yeah, I didn't at the time, and I would not have admitted it at the time. I don't think I, but I think it's really important to have a little bit try and have a bit of accountability to not just be a victim. Because in being accountable, it actually, although it's gnarly and painful to look at, it also ends up giving you a bit of strength. Does that make sense? Kate Daly 6:04 Yeah, it does, because it's that line, isn't it? Between I might know that everything isn't perfect, but where does that line of perfectionism meet? This is good enough, it's got enough legs that it might well last and we'll work at it. And that's the blurry bit in the middle, isn't it? So, you know, I don't suppose very many people go into a marriage thinking this is absolutely as perfect as ever I have. Absolutely, I'm 100% no doubt. Maybe they do. I don't know, maybe I should speak for other people. But it just strikes me that everybody must at some point it must cross their mind to question. And where does questioning become a genuine red flag or doubt that you ignore versus something you say, okay, this is this has got enough legs to give this a go and to see where we get to, kind of thing. And I just, it's so hard to find that line. It's interesting the way you describe it. Jess Robinson 6:59 Yeah, I think I don't know who taught me, maybe my mum, maybe just from looking at other people's relationships, I knew that compromise was really important. But I think possibly I compromised myself a bit too much. I was a bit too much of a people, I'm a recovering people pleaser anyway. And it was way I was not giving enough weight to the stuff that wasn't right and giving maybe too much weight to the absolute fun, the laughter, all of the good bits, where I thought I'm never gonna meet someone else who makes me laugh like this, you know? Yeah. Kate Daly 7:35 And I think it's fascinating as well that you talk about just that sense of the things that you were compromising on that actually turned out to be pretty significant values? What kind of things were that important that you were prepared to say, oh, that's fine, because you were together for a while before you married. So, how did you cross from being not married to married? And did the act of being married focus something, which ultimately ended the relationship? Because you do hear about this quite a lot, don't you? People will live together for a long time, they'll marry, and then then they'll split after the marriage. Jess Robinson 8:11 So once we got married, there was a death of someone very close to him and his family. And um, trying to choose my words carefully, but basically, again, I I found myself there was some behavior from him, and what I ended up doing was convincing myself again, this is because of grief. Uh, he's not thinking straight. And when I did finally confide in someone, when the words came out and I heard them as if for the first time, I just knew, oh my gosh, this is not tenable. This is absolutely not tenable for me. Kate Daly 8:53 That's interesting, isn't it? That act of saying it out loud, of of repeating it as a narrative, actually sort of almost shocks you out of a stupor you're in when you're in a relationship with somebody and gets you to focus and say, if I was hearing that from somebody else, that would be a big red flag or a big warning bell. Jess Robinson 9:11 Yeah. And I had always said, you know, with my friends' relationships or people on telly or whatever, I wouldn't put up with that. I would never put up with that. Also, I wasn't telling anybody. I just, I just pretended that that part of my life was sorted. Yeah. So so it took a lot for me to, and I was amazed at myself. I'm still amazed at myself that I ignored so much, willfully ignored so much. Kate Daly 9:38 But I think that's a very human thing, isn't it? We all ignore things when it doesn't fit with our kind of narrative of where we are in life and what we're doing. So tell me a little bit about the the breakup. I don't mean the details of why you broke up, but what kind of divorce did you have? Jess Robinson 9:54 How did you go about that? We were on a sort of a make or break holiday. And he finally said, I'm gonna say what he said, because it was the real turning point. He said, I don't find you sexually attractive, and I never have. Oh wow. And that was a terrible thing to hear, but I also felt like, thank God, that's what I needed to hear. And I called my sister and I said, Can I come home now? I told her, she was like, Yes, get on a plane. And so I needed to hear something. I don't know if he even meant it to sound so harsh. I think he was just being trying to be honest or something. I don't know. But that was what I needed to hear for me to just get on the plane. My mum and dad picked me up from the airport. I went back to theirs, I had a cry, and the next day I started filling in my divorce. It so happened that my big sister, while I was doing this, knocked on the door and my mum opened it and she had all teary eyes, and she had just left her husband as well. So wow. Yeah, mum consumed about half a bottle of brandy that night. Feeling for your mum in that scenario rather wrongly, maybe. But and dad was just being, you know, shocked and very good humoured about it all. And I felt very, very lucky that I had a family that I could talk to. But then obviously, then all of these things came out and the stuff that I had been hiding. And everybody was shocked and surprised and amused and horrified. And it just all happened very fast. I I sent off the divorce. I went and got a a black fur coat, fake fur coat, so I looked like a divorce, a widow. I don't know what I was doing. I made some very strange decisions. You're playing the punt. Yeah. I think I went on guardian soulmates almost a week later, just like I must fix this immediately. So, yes, it was it was quite bonkers, and and I moved pretty fast. But once I had made the decision, I was ready. And it felt like a huge relief. There's a tiny voice in me when he said that, and I knew that I could come home and leave. A little voice in me said, Yes, this is what I've always wanted, as though a dream had just come true. Kate Daly 12:20 So you got that sense of relief, that sense of being able to move on, of living a true and authentic life, all of that kind of stuff. Yeah. It must be kind of weird then, if when people say, Oh, I'm so sorry, when you know, when you're actually not feeling sorry, you're feeling there's a sense of relief. Jess Robinson 12:37 Yes. The thing that I felt the most actually, my biggest, biggest overwhelming feeling was shame. Kate Daly 12:45 Oh, okay. Jess Robinson 12:46 Because I felt I had betrayed myself so much. And I had, there were so many people saying, Why didn't you say? Why didn't you tell us? We would have said, you know. And I just had such shame that I was seen as this strong person who always said, I wouldn't do that. I'd never take that. And I was doing it all along, taking it all along, and I felt very, very stupid. Kate Daly 13:12 Oh, that's interesting. That's a harsh thing to say about yourself, isn't it? I felt very, very stupid. What drives that? Why do we feel like that as strong, confident women? Why do we still feel a sense of shame? Jess Robinson 13:24 I felt shame because I thought I'd wasted everybody's time. My dad, we we did the cheapest wedding we possibly could, but it was still, you know, £8,000 at the time. And that was my dad's money. And, you know, when I knew and admitted that even before I got married, there was a tiny bit of me that knew it wasn't right. I felt accountable for that, I guess. And um, I just felt like I'd wasted time, I'd wasted people's goodwill. I'd I'd just been stupid. And I'm going to ask you whether you still feel that now. I'm conflicted. I want to say no, I don't. But I think if I'm being kind to myself, which I think I must be, I think the the idea and the hope and the sort of the idea of of a filmic sort of romance made me a bit blind. I don't know if that makes any sense. But um yeah, wildly hoping, willfully ignoring I don't know. Kate Daly 14:29 But I guess my view feeling of it is is more that all roads lead to here. And maybe when you come on to tell us your the next part of your story, I can ask you that question again then. Because we can only get to the paths that we eventually find by treading the ones that come before that, can't we? So without anything that happened before, you wouldn't be here now with your life as the way it is now, and the incredibly successful career and personal life and everything else. So let's go back a step then and tell us. So you went through you you got your divorce to organized. It sounds like you were terribly organized and you had the presence of mind and the support to be able to get on with it. And yes, it feels like it was a real like everyone does it differently. There's no right or wrong, but this one feels like a plaster being ripped off, focused on it. You knew this is where you were gonna go now, and off you went. So you come out the other side of divorce. Jess Robinson 15:28 Yes, within about less than two years. Kate Daly 15:31 Okay, so that's very good going by all accounts with all the people that I talked to and see. Yeah. Jess Robinson 15:37 Yeah, yes, it was it was very, I mean, it wasn't painless, it was horrible, but it was a plaster being ripped off. You're right. Kate Daly 15:45 It sounds logistically amicable then. So logistically, it was amicable, you didn't go to court, you got everything sorted, you didn't have children, as you mentioned, so there wasn't the added complication of that. So you come out the other side, and it sounds like you were fairly desperate to replace and uh with a relationship, was it? You said you mentioned guardian soulmates pretty quickly. Jess Robinson 16:10 Oh my gosh, I think I doubled my numbers the next, you know, in the year after that. Because I think also because of what he had said about you know not being sexually attractive, and I think I wanted a point to prove and desirable. And yeah, I had a huge point to prove. Luckily, my numbers weren't that huge before, so we're all right. But I went, I went on so many dates and I moved into a flat on the other side of London and sort of went a bit uh off the rails a little bit. I think I was very, very sad and just trying to put a plaster over a wound which needed actually probably a bit of stitches, if you see what I mean. So I did a lot of yoga, I did a lot of drinking, I wrote a car off from divorce exhaustion. Oh, it was ridiculous. But in the end, I came out the other side. I couldn't have done it without my amazing friends who really did all rally around me. And then, of course, I made a show about it as well, which everybody said, Yes, is that a good idea? Is that a bit too soon to be sharing everything on stage? But it actually was my way of processing it. So I was gonna say, was it a form of therapy then? Lots of comedians who did just say the same thing. Yeah. Yeah. Just people had to pay to come and see me do my therapy. And it probably had more lights, it had more impressions in it than others. But yeah, and I was getting stronger, and I had a lot of anger that I had to deal with, and I had to work out sort of where to put those feelings. Suddenly I was so angry towards him, and it's very I and that stayed with me for a few years, but it's got less now, and well, it's not there at all anymore, which is amazing because what I really learned from the whole experience was to always, from now on, never ever ignore my gut feelings, never do that ignoring and be really true to myself. That was a huge lesson. Kate Daly 18:23 But it's interesting what you say about it being such an important life lesson. Um, and that the importance of actually understanding how you work and committing to listening to your gut instinct rather than driving it down. I think that's so interesting. Jess Robinson 18:40 I mean, it's taken another 10 years to practice it and actually speak up for myself, even if I've recognised the feelings. Kate Daly 18:46 But yeah, but that's part of the process, isn't it? The first step of any change is to recognize what's going on, then to be able to name it, and then to practice doing the small first step of doing something about it. It takes, it does take a lot of time and a number of years to actually get good at something. So I it sounds like you've been on an amazing journey. What you know, what when you were dating, do you think you were able to practice some of that as well? Was dating about practicing or was it about scratching a niche? Jess Robinson 19:15 A bit of both. It was seeing what it was like to be on the apps because that wasn't there before. So, and that very the novelty of that wore off extremely quickly. That's exhausting and it is. You met some very weird. Kate Daly 19:30 It's a full-time job, I think, isn't it? Jess Robinson 19:32 Trying to deal with all the messages and the slightest thing. Absolutely. Yeah, yeah, overwhelming. It was interesting to meet the different people that I thought this is what you could have won, you know. Maybe I want someone really wealthy, or maybe I want someone who's already got, I don't know, a business. Or maybe I'm, you know, it was interesting to just see who was out there. And very quickly I became jaded and just thought, that's it. I've had enough now. So that's enough. And that's when my friend called me up and said, I've got tickets to a show tonight. My friend Handsome Johnti is playing. Do you want to come along? And I said, handsome not Johnti. He said, Yeah, he's single. I said, nope, I don't want to meet anyone. And my friend said, Well, you get a free dinner. So I said, Okay, I'll come. Okay. Fair enough. And um, and that's when I met my husband, my now husband. Yeah. Kate Daly 20:29 So it wasn't a conscious decision that you were ready for a relationship, it was fatigue with just dating and a desire to uh a comfort of being on your own almost. Jess Robinson 20:40 Yes, exactly. I actually knew at that point I I very much was not ready for a relationship. I didn't want one at all. And then I met Johnti. Yeah. So he was also divorced, same sort of time period as me. He had a little boy who had just turned five, I think, when I met him. And I just said, you know, we we just started very slowly. I said, I I can't commit to anything. I can do one date at a time. That's all I can say. And then it sort of turned quite quickly, actually, because there was absolutely no pressure. We didn't want to see anybody else, but we just didn't want to well, I didn't want to say it was anything. I just wanted to spend time with him. Then it was one month. Yeah. Yeah. And then it was one month at a time. And yeah. And by end of 2016, I think, I had a boyfriend. And then I was married by 2019. And this is from both of us had said at the very beginning, never want to get married again. Absolutely not, never doing that again. Kate Daly 21:55 Wow. Jess Robinson 21:56 Yeah. Kate Daly 21:57 So from free dinner to boyfriend. To husband in the space of three years, then? Jess Robinson 22:03 I mean, yes. And again, you know, my friends around me this time I was being very open. And they were all saying, Jess, this is very fast. This is very soon. This is, you know, because I think the relationship with practice husband, as I call him, ended in 20, I want to say 2015. So by the end of 2016, I'd met Jonti. Yeah. So that it does feel very fast, doesn't it? I did a lot of therapy. Kate Daly 22:33 I was gonna say, when did the therapy pick come in? Jess Robinson 22:35 Aside from obviously bearing all on stage, but I had was having regular therapy once a week from the next day that I came back from that holiday, straight into therapy. That sounds like it was a good decision. Kate Daly 22:50 It must have accelerated the healing process. Jess Robinson 22:52 I think so. But I also think I've supported it maybe. Supported it for sure. And I think even uh uh through 2017, 2018, before Johnti and I got married, I think I was still, there was still healing and working things out to to do. And I know there are still things from Johnti's first marriage, which are still things that are still sort of old wounds or bruises, let's say, that you know, because there are still things that can be slightly triggering or bring up old feelings or things like that for sure. Kate Daly 23:26 And do you think you had a different set of conversations when you were thinking about getting married for a second time than the first? Jess Robinson 23:34 Yeah, I think so. But also when I started getting together with Jonti, I was so focused inward. I was so cautious and careful and really trying to name and look at every single tiny feeling that came up because I was so determined to not do any ignoring or any brushing under the carpet again. So I was really, I was journaling and I was, I mean, probably almost psychotically, just you know, really, and he and he gave me so much space and he was so that I I would, he is the kindest man I have ever met. He's so kind and steady and gentle and gave me so much space to be able to do that. Kate Daly 24:28 And it sounds like you must have mirrored that back, particularly if he's got a child, and so for him, he's making a commitment on behalf of both of them, isn't he? Him and his son. Yeah. Absolutely. I guess what he's mirroring, and you're mirroring back what you both need, which is although it feels very fast, you're doing it at your own pace. Jess Robinson 24:50 Yes, it did feel like that. There was a lot of such a lot of talking and communication and really good, honest chats. I wasn't introduced to my stepson now till quite far in when we knew it was something. And even then, I was just introduced as daddy's friend, you know, just just to take things slowly and and cautiously. But uh what was that like? It was good. I think the main thing that Johnti and I agreed for that was that he's the center of attention. He should feel like a special guy. So it's not really about Johnti and me. It's about us making together making him feel really special and just having a wonderful time. We went in the sea and we went on the pier and we had, you know, it was just a lovely day out. And it felt good. I had never thought that I would end up with somebody who already had a child and who was 13 years older than me as well. There's a big age gap. So that was another thing to navigate that I thought I would end up with a, I don't know, a businessman, the same age as me this time, and had a helicopter, and you know, but but no. But it really actually really proved to me that it really is about the person and not the material things. Yeah, the labels. Yeah. Yeah, not the labels, none of this my type on paper, you know. It's just it's about values, having similar values and a similar sense of humor all also helps, but values and honesty, I think. And I love being a step-mum. I love it. Kate Daly 26:28 Well, I was gonna say, how have you navigated that journey then? So tell us a little bit about that. So from a first meet to marrying and therefore becoming a stepparent, and what's what has that been like? Jess Robinson 26:39 Never been under any pressure to call me mum or or step mum or anything. There was a conversation early on when he, you know, I said, You can call me, you can call me Jess, you can say I'm your friend, you can you can call me whatever you like. And he decided on cheeky stepmom. So we've gone from that. It's worked really well, actually. It was it was funny to begin with. I was introduced to mum, and that was slightly awkward and weird, but actually, she texts me now, and I'm gonna drop him off early. Will he be in that sort of thing? And we just have a a back and forth, and it just feels really nice. And I'm not trying to be his mum either. I think that's really important. I do co-parent a bit. I mean, I'm there to do school pickups and dinners and and things like that. But the thing that I can do the best with him is, for example, tutor him with his English or help him with his music. Or the other day I helped him write a speech. And I love being able to do that. I love being able to be involved and be someone to turn to if he needs to talk, or just someone to hang out with one night and watch films and eat eat sweet, you know. It's lovely. Kate Daly 28:00 It's like he's got an extra person, isn't it? That's what I think is so lovely about the whole step-parent culture is you've got your parents and then you've got some extra people who also want to. Cheerleader. I mean, who does need an extra cheerleader? That's that's just that's what is the magic of step-parenting. I think where it where it gets intense is where you're trying to replace roles and there's a power battle that becomes really tricky then. But I think if you can be the cheerleader for the child, then what an amazing role. Jess Robinson 28:34 That's it. And I never knew whether I really wanted my own children or not. But this seems to have, if we're putting it into its very most minimal way of describing it, it's scratched an itch. But it's really given me so much. I love helping him. I love watching him develop. I love it when he's naughty and cheeky and being witty. And it it he's just brilliant. He's a really brilliant boy. And I love seeing his confidence grow as well as he grows into a really great young man. Yeah. He's awesome. Kate Daly 29:09 So I'm gonna go back to that question then um that I asked you earlier. Jess Robinson 29:14 Oh. Kate Daly 29:14 Um do all roads lead to here? Do you feel over the shame? Yes, I do. Actually. Would you have that relationship with your stepson and your husband if you hadn't come on the journey you've been on? Jess Robinson 29:31 No, I absolutely. Kate Daly 29:32 I don't mean would you have met them? Let's assume you would have met them anyway, but would your relationships feel like this had you not had your previous experience? Jess Robinson 29:39 No, I don't think so. And I think had I not had my previous experience, I probably wouldn't even have entertained a relationship with my husband. I wouldn't have probably not. I and that feels very that feels like don't don't let that pass you by. Don't don't do that. Kate Daly 30:01 Because it's it's wonderful. So your your previous experience, the the road you've travelled up to that point and the shame that you felt and been able to overcome has got you to a point where you've been able to keep your eyes open to something that naturally you'd have had them closed to, then maybe. Yes, I think. I'm just, you know, I just find this whole thing fascinating. I don't hold on to a sense of shame and regret for very many things ever. I just regret just not rightly or wrongly, just not an emotion I'd personally hang on to or have. Because I don't think any of the good things that I've got now, I would have unless I'd traveled that road. And that's how I kind of maybe I just square being a really terrible person in previous life. I don't know. Who knows? But that's kind of how I look at it. And it it just strikes me that, you know, what you're describing now, your ability to make that connection as a step parent and to have the relationship you've got with somebody who you wouldn't in the in your sort of previous life trajectory have entertained, come into contact with, given a second thought to, just feels like it's given you a richness that you wouldn't otherwise have had. Jess Robinson 31:18 I wouldn't change it for anything. And yes, that's exactly right. That is exactly right. A richness that I wouldn't have had is such a fab way to put it. And I wouldn't change it for anything. It feels so lovely to be in such a little, we call ourselves a little pack without dog Brian. It feels, it feels like a very special little family. Yeah. Kate Daly 31:41 That's such a lovely story, Jess. Really is lovely. In a minute, Jess, I'm gonna ask you to give us your sort of top tip for entering a new relationship post-separation. But just before I do, I just want to say if this episode has given you a bit of clarity or comfort or just a tip that's made things feel a little bit more manageable, make sure to follow the divorce podcast on your favourite podcast app. Each week we're here with expert advice and real support to help you through your separation one step at a time. So, final tips then, Jess. What's your biggest tip for somebody on the other side of the separation process who's thinking about dating again or starting a new relationship? Jess Robinson 32:21 Keep checking in with yourself. You don't want to close yourself off to new experiences, and maybe it's good to have a few practice dates and practice saying, no, that's not okay for me as well. No, I don't like that. That's quite empowering in itself. But yeah, keep checking in with yourself and maybe do some journaling. I always find, or I've found at the time as well, what went well always helps. Just three things that went well that day, even if the date was a disaster, even if it's just, you know, I got there on time, I felt that it wasn't right, and I listened to my feelings, you know, or something like that. One of the things that really stuck with me when I was just coming out of the relationship and so, so, so low. I texted a friend of mine who had been through a divorce and and I knew had a girlfriend, and I just said, I just feel like I'll never be happy again. I don't know how I'll ever be happy again. And he said, You will, I promise you, you will. And you could, I could not believe it at the time. I honestly couldn't. Things were so dark. I was so down in the weeds. But if this is happening to you, it's possible and you will be happy again. And you've just got to keep putting one foot in front of the other, just small steps, one day at a time, one hour at a time. Kate Daly 33:47 Oh, that's amazing advice. And you know, we did a survey recently, and we know that nearly half, about 45% of men and women are dating again within a year. And if you're Gen Z, it's probably around 60%. So you can do it. People do get back out there, and getting back on the horse feels like it's a real kind of key to just, and like you say, it doesn't have to be the next big relationship, just getting a bit date aware and going on a few dates to see what it's like. That's what my co-founder always used to say to me, because I was a real procrastinator and I didn't date for ages. She's just like, it doesn't have to be the love of your life. You can just go on a few bad dates. That's not the end of the world. So I think if you just sort of think of it like that, just get on a few bad dates, you'll be okay. Jess Robinson 34:29 Yeah, I nearly didn't go on, I nearly didn't go on a date with John T when he asked me. And my mum said, Oh, go, go and be treated nicely, go and be taken out for dinner. Why not? And so I did, and and I stood there in the went down to the ladies' loos, and I was pinching myself, literally pinching my arm to make sure that I was really there because it was so wonderful, and he was so nice and he so understood me. So it can happen, but take it slowly, and you don't have to call it anything until you're ready and pinch the label. Yeah, exactly. Kate Daly 35:05 Yeah. Jess Robinson 35:06 Yeah. Kate Daly 35:06 Listen, that's all we've got time for today. I can't thank you enough for joining me. Where can people find out more information about you and what are you up to? Jess Robinson 35:14 They could find me on my website, jessrobinson.co.uk, and I'm on Instagram and Facebook and all the other ones. I am currently touring and going to the Edinburgh Festival with my show, Elton Reimagined, and it's all Elton John songs reimagined through the voices and styles of some of my favorite pop divas. So we've got Britney Spears doing but Benny and the Jets, and we've got Amy Winehouse doing Tiny Dancer and Kate Bush doing goodbye, yellow big wood. And um it's really uplifting. It's a slice of joy. If you heard, I tell you what, if you hear me on the the divorce podcast and you need a bit of joy, then just get in touch and I'll give you a discount code if it's fantastic. Sounds brilliant. That's that's what we all need right now. Kate Daly 36:06 Yeah, slice of joy, a slice of joy in Edinburgh. I cannot think of anything better. It sounds wonderful. So thank you. Don't forget for separation and co-parenting support, you can visit us at amicable.co.uk where you can find our resources or you can book a free advice consultation. You can find me on LinkedIn and Insta, and you can hear about new podcast episodes by subscribing for updates and visiting thedivorsepodcast.com, or you can find us on your favourite listening platform. We'd love to know how we can help for others, so please share any questions on divorce or separation and co-parenting with us. You can do that at hello at amicable.co.uk. And don't forget you can also join our subscription platform, Amicable Space, where you'll find our community forum. And that's a safe place to ask all sorts of questions as you go through divorce or separation or co-parenting. Members also get access to our free monthly QA webinar with Amicables divorce specialists. So look out for that. Thank you so much for joining me today, Jess. It's been an absolute pleasure talking to you. Thank you for being so open and candid. I'd love to thank you, everybody, for listening.